how did kayce and monica meet on yellowstone
Behind the Story - Kill the Messenger. Sisters' Star Spilts From Husband, Kevin Costner's Lawyer Addresses 'Yellowstone' Season 5 Dispute, 'Yellowstone' Season 5 Reportedly Won't Continue Until the End of the Year, 'The Office' Star Revealed as TV's Highest Paid Actor. Yellowstone Season 1 06/15/2018. Monica also sees to be doing much better, surrounding herself with family. He never chose to raise him like he did Jaime, and Rip never forgot it. As their go-between, Beth has been unaware that anything has happened at all, possibly meaning she could switch allegiance when she later uncovers the truth, bolstered by her blackmailing of Jamie. Alive However, while the family thinks their well-being is the be-all and end-all, their actual concern should be for the ranch itself. Kayce warned his wife Monica (Kelsey Asbille) over the phone to take their son Tate (Brecken Merrill) to the bunkhouse. [3], His wife Monica was pregnant once again while their oldest son, Tate, was in his teens. They seem to quietly agree that their night together does not mean they are back, but they are interrupted in the middle of the night by their son, Tate (Brecken Merrill), who is overjoyed to find his mom and dad together. John and Evelyn Dutton were blessed with three more children: Kayce has two brothers (Lee and Jamie) and a sister (Beth). Thursday, December 23rd, 2021. Credit: Paramount screenshot. What in the world did he actually see? After Beth discovered that Jamie knew his father was behind the attempted murder, she gave her brother a trio of options in order to repent, including prison time and being beaten up. Kayce's vision at the end of season four could have seen something happen to Monica's baby. Female WebThe following is a list of episodes from Yellowstone, an American drama television series created by Taylor Sheridan and John Linson that premiered on June 20, 2018, on the Paramount Network.. As of January 1, 2023, 47 episodes of Yellowstone have aired, currently in its fifth season. They need to say some things to each other., For Asbille, when I read it in the script, I saw it one way. In the penultimate episode of the season, Kayce tries to make sense of his frequent wolf sightings and gets advice from Chief Rainwater and Mo. In the penultimate episode of the season, Kayce tries to make sense of his frequent wolf sightings and gets advice from Chief Rainwater and Mo. Kayce and Monica had a son they named Tate and lived on the Broken Rock Indian Reservation. Daybreak- season 1, episode 1, Tate Dutton (son), John Dutton IV (son), John Dutton III (father), Evelyn Dutton (mother), Lee Dutton (brother), Jamie Dutton (brother), Beth Dutton (sister), John Dutton Jr. (grandfather), Robert Long (brother-in-law), Felix Long (grandfather-in-law). Monica Dutton Kayce, who had in the previous episode stopped by and begged Monica to take him back, was overjoyed to get the call and exclaimed how much he missed her. John Dutton welcomed the new boy onto his family's ranch, giving the orphan a home again. What will hook viewers now is the ways in which the family can possibly stick together and whether allegiances will change as the ugly truth comes out. Albeit, within Yellowstone, but Monica (Kelsey Asbille) and Kayce Dutton (Luke Grimes) also lost a child at the start of this current season of the show. The Long Black Train (season 1, episode 4), The Fangs of Freedom (season 1, episode 5), Nature's Empty Throne (season 1, episode 2), The War Has Come Home (season 1, episode 3), War and the Turquoise Tide (season 1, episode 4), One Ocean Closer to Destiny (season 1, episode 6), Incident of the Tumbleweed (season 1, episode 1), Incident at Alabaster Plain (season 1, episode 2), Incident with an Executioner (season 1, episode 3), Incident of the Widowed Dove (season 1, episode 4), Incident on the Edge of Madness (season 1, episode 5), Incident of the Power and the Plow (season 1, episode 6), Wild Dog of the Tetons (season 1, episode 5), Incident at the Hanging Tree (season 1, episode 6), The Ghost of Chaparral (season 1, episode 3), Best Man for the Job (season 1, episode 4), A Quiet Day in Tucson (season 1, episode 5). Yet a more prevalent question might be what does this mean for Kayce and Monica? In the midseason finale, it becomes clear that understanding young Rip is essential to understanding the changes in John. Unfortunately, this didn't pan out. Audiences have also seen her character put her own life and body on the line to bring a serial rapist to justice and ensure the safety of other women. video. Only time will tell whether that turns out to be the truth or if the couple finds a way to persevere and make things work. From Kayces journey so far, we know that Kayce didnt want anything to do with his familys ranch, but that changes after the death of his brother. WebHe had only loved two things in his life, the Yellowstone and Beth. Therefore, Kayce decides to leave the Yellowstone Ranch and settles down near the Broken Rock Reservation. Yellowstone: Kayce Duttons Dark Argument with Monica Woke Up Something Inside Him. Subscribe to our newsletter for new stories, tips & events. It is a smart move by Kayce and one that likely saved his marriage and family. ("A Monster is Among Us"). We dont know which path he chose, but he told Monica that it was the end of us upon his return. Though the effects of Jamie's thinking remain unclear, the Dutton family might not look recognizable when we see Season 5 return. If "Dallas" gave us the cliffhanger of who shot J.R., "Yellowstone" Season 5 is leaving us hooked on what happens to the Dutton family. In reality, the Hanbleceya is a rite of passage for young warriors in the Lakota tribe, and is one of the Lakota people's seven sacred ceremonies. Reeling from the earlier attack on Yellowstone Ranch, Monica and Tate are not doing well with the aftermath. We will get some help in finding this answer from an article by The Cinemaholic. Played by Viewers might think they are watching "The West Wing," as "Yellowstone" has pivoted from cattle ranch chaos into a powerhouse politicaldrama. He now understood Kayce Dutton and his reluctance to be a part of the Yellowstone due to Monica since Tate was born. Here's exactly what went down in the "Yellowstone" Season 5 midseason finale. Kayce John Dutton is a horseman and ranch hand, son of ranch owner John Dutton and his wife Evelyn Dutton, married to Monica Long. While Jamie is hellbent on taking John down, there might be another factor to take into account if John is incriminated by what happened at the train station, so is Jamie. Thomas Rainwater is there, and he walks to meet John. #YellowstoneTV pic.twitter.com/IBj5a1dGKx. is not one that the creators of "Yellowstone" would have been looking for, with fans citing the excitement could easily be picked up and replaced by spinoffs such as "1923.". They knew, however, that it would be impossible as long as Kayce remained so involved with the family ranch. Yellowstone Wiki is a FANDOM TV Community. Will Kayce and Monica reunite for good, will their hookup make everything even more complicated? In an effort to convince Kayce, Monica, and Tate to relocate to the Yellowstone Ranch, John and Jamie arrange for Mel Thompson of the Montana State University to offer Monica a job in their expanding liberal arts department as a Native American Studies adjunct professor while she studies for her doctorate. Kayce and Monica have an intense conversation, forcing Kayce to make a move to save his family. She meets with the president of Montana State University to tell him she's reconsidered his offer to join the faculty, but he informs her that the funds earmarked for her salary were reallocated for the current semester, but if she was willing to teach a single American History class that would get her foot in the door until the following semester when the funds would be available for her again. If Yellowstone fans will remember, way back in Season 1, John Dutton opened up to Kayces wife Monica about why he branded his son. Read More: Does Rip Die in Yellowstone Season 4 Finale? [8], Click here for the main page of the Montana Livestock Association.Kayce followed in his father's and brother's footsteps when he started to work as a Livestock Agent for the Montana Livestock Association. The fact that a girl appeared in Kayces dream also has fans speculating over whether Monica is pregnant. Buffy, though, was his. Her feelings of resentment arent unfounded, as Monica and her son have regularly found themselves embroiled in conflicts over the land. Its a desire and a love for the same thing for different reasons.. Shortly after moving to the ranch, she witnesses the aftermath of Beth's assault at the hands of the Beck brother's enforcers. Kayce was on the scene and saw his brother get shot by Robert Long, Kayce's brother-in-law. [3], Click here for the main page of the Yellowstone Dutton Ranch.When his father gave him a chance to come back on the ranch, Kayce went to live in the bunkhouse and started to work his way back in. [2], Kayce later started his own family by marrying Monica Long, the granddaughter of Indian elder Felix Long and the sister of Robert Long. In an effort to convince Kayce, Monica, and Tate to relocate to the Yellowstone Ranch, John and Jamie arrange for Mel Thompson of the Montana State University to offer Monica a job in their expanding liberal arts department as a Native American Studies adjunct professor while she studies for her doctorate. Over the course of the epic contemporary Western "Yellowstone,"Kelsey Asbille's Monica Dutton has been through a lot. Read More: What is Four Sixes Ranch? However, the familys time at the ranch has been marred by tragedies. Aside from playing Monica in Yellowstone(2018-), Kelsey Asbille is most known for playing Mikayla inPair of Kings(2010-2013) and Tracy Stewart in Teen Were halfway through the 10-episode fourth season of Yellowstone and well get our next dose this Sunday. Change my mind. Jamie opted for the third option, which saw him return to his father, Garett Dutton, only to shoot him in the head a shocking death for fans of the series. We all will wait until the fall of 2022, probably, for that new season to hit on the Paramount Network. Fans of the drama series took to Twitter after the shocking hookup, sending their hopes that the couple finally reunites for good. What happened to Monica on Yellowstone? It's not only touching and a much-appreciated bit of respite from the intensity of Jamie, John, and Beth's bloodshed, but it also drills down deeper into something that's been bubbling away at the surface. In the penultimate episode of the Despite their separation, Monica still seems to be holding on to hope of a reconciliation, as she rejected flirtation from her physical therapist in last week's episode, telling him she is married. The mid-season finale of "Yellowstone" sees the pair getting intimate, with Sarah revealing that she would be open to meeting with hitmen on Jamie's behalf. By the end of the midseason finale, Beth finally finds out that the train station exists, setting the drama up for all hell to break loose. Monica Dutton is the wife of Kayce Dutton and the mother of Tate Dutton. The wolf promises to help Kayce walk whichever road he chooses. Id never been in a scene that hectic before, and it was actually a lot of fun to try to make happen.. Yellowstone fans may need to take a seat to try and keep up with how crazy this theory is.. While we now know that one of our favorite shows new season is coming this Fall, the waiting isnt getting any easier.Have a probable end date is nice, but considering we were all expecting Yellowstone Season 4 at some Gender WebHome. It could easily be the end of "Yellowstone" as we know it. Appears in Others were quick to agree, and one fan expressed their thoughts on why Monica's character has grown less and less three-dimensional. Relationship status The wolf takes a seat and the Duttons do the deed. Who Is California Roll on 'The Masked Singer' Season 9, Episode 3? WebKayce (Luke Grimes) and Monica (Kelsey Asbille) have overcome a lot in their relationship, but it always comes back to one thing: Family. Kayce and Monica appear poised to be the stable anchoring point of the season's second half, with Rip's role in the "Yellowstone" drama remaining a total wild card. "A Knife and No Coin". Something more akin to, say, Monica's character from earlier seasons, who possessed strength and intelligence we've yet to see from her in Season 4. Kayce (Luke Grimes) isnt so sure. of appearances Yellowstone airs Wednesdays at 10 p.m. Hed never just flat out yelled at her before., Playing that in that moment, I felt maybe he felt like he was becoming more like the parts of his father that he doesnt like or he saw that he was falling in line with the attitude of that place, and I think it scared him. When Avery (rather randomly, given her character's history) throws herself at Kayce later on, he's able to gently reject her advances. The series was renewed for a fifth season that was originally The moment is followed by Kayce kissing Avery. Kayce and Monica could prove to be lynchpins for the ranch's comeback, though while Monica finally feels as though she belongs, Kayce might be looking for an escape route. On the other hand, John seemingly believes that Kayce has left for good evident through his conversation with Beth. They survived but Kayce had to shoot a man to put him out of his misery. About Us; Staff; Camps; Scuba. But that has to change eventually, right? Monica becomes pregnant, and Kayce is overjoyed by the news. Alright, its time to get wild. Occupation The mid-season finale of "Yellowstone" sees the pair getting intimate, with Sarah revealing that she would be open to meeting with hitmen on Jamie's behalf. However, the fact that the stakes are so high means that the second part of Season 5 could be set up for the finale of all finales. The answer remains unclear. With Kevin Costner's involvement infuture seasons uncertain, the drama for the second half of Season 5 could easily reach life-or-death heights. They went on to call Monica's jealousy storyline "so stupid and illogical.". @ParamountNet pic.twitter.com/e7xZKmdPt2, After experiencing his vision, Kayce returned to Monica and said I saw the end of us.. All rights reserved. ("Resurrection Day", "Behind Us Only Grey"). These are just a couple of questions, among many, that Yellowstone fans have when it comes to Kayce. Her marriage to Kayce Dutton put the couple in a difficult position between the Yellowstone Ranch, the Dutton family and the Native Americans of Broken Rock. Jamie has been carried away with his political ambitions, and Sarah is being dragged into his murky web. She was a faculty member at Heartson Recently, however, audiences have yet to see Monica do much except occasionally react to various traumas. Therefore, if the path Kayce chooses leads him back to the Yellowstone Ranch, it could spell the end of Kayce and Monicas relationship. It will have to take us into Season 5, Outsiders, before some answers can be received. We dont refer to Kayce and Monica as the most tortured couple on Yellowstone for nothing theyve been through the wringer and not always emerged together. Some have pointed out that this mundane disappointment could be because the overall action was paced too quickly. Is Cole Hausers Rip Leaving Yellowstone. However, Rip's branding also gives us an idea of how the rest of Season 5 could shake out. She intended to continue teaching days at the reservation's school and do afternoons and nights at the university. Then we see him kissingAvery, played by Tanaya Beatty. Fans have speculated that Averys appearance in Kayces vision had a part to play in his prophecy about his and Monicas relationship coming to an end. Who's to say that Rip or his younger self won't make more cameos further down the line? From its opening moments back in Season 1, "Yellowstone" has never shied away from a healthy splattering of blood and violence, so it's surprising to see Episode 8 wrapped up quietly. What does the future hold for them and the baby that Monica is carrying right now? - July 17, 2019 10:47 pm EDT. The shootout scene in Episode 1 was an adrenaline rush, Grimes says. It's a pretty harsh insult, but perhaps not unwarranted. Kayce takes Monica and Tate to live with Monicas parents for a few days. Elsewhere, Kayce had a vision that began with an owl and flashbacks of his Navy SEAL days. Its complicated, but he cant help but feel connected. In his speech to the assembly, Jamie announces a request for impeachment, which counterpoints John's support for Chairman Rainwater and the planned pipeline. Episode 8 of Season 5 titled "A Knife and No Coin" has left viewers with more questions than they have answers, and the fight between various members of the Dutton family is reaching its boiling point. This season, she tries to get as far away from the Duttons as possible and their f**ked up family drama, Asbille says. With the season's second half set to air in late summer 2023, rumors and fan theories are already trying to decipher what might happen next. By using our Services, you agree to our use of cookies. Seeing his mother in trouble, Tate is forced to shoot and kill the man. The ambiguity over the paths Kayce sees from the cliffs makes it harder to determine the meaning of Kayces spiritual experience. She was born in 1991 in Columbia, South Carolina to Jean Chow and Dr. James Chow. Then we see him kissing Avery, played by Tanaya Beatty. One of the buzz phrases that circles around "A Knife and No Coin" is the train station the events of which could easily lead to John's undoing. Monica Long was still alive and well when Yellowstones fifth season took its midseason break, having rekindled her relationship with Kayce. Instead, Monica's only tension came from an egregious and uncharacteristic bout of jealousy that, given what she once was for the series, took the recession of her character just a bit too far. Scuba Certification; Private Scuba Lessons; Scuba Refresher for Certified Divers; Try Scuba Diving; Enriched Air Diver (Nitrox) Monica and Kayce have had their shares of up and downs on "Yellowstone," but it was a particularly low relationship moment in Season 2 where some felt Monica was at her worst. Throughout the series, Monica is kept unaware of her brother's death early on, and after his widow commits suicide in what Monica considers a sacrifice for their children's welfare, she expresses to Kayce that she feels they ought to consider leaving the reservation to spare Tate the sadness of his cousins moving to Seattle to live with their grandparents. Yellowstone season 4 is charting fresh territories by providing exciting new conflicts for the Dutton family members to deal with. Age/birth date Though some fans on Reddit have criticized the impromptu mass graveyard as a plothole, its significance is huge in the broader picture. He sees two paths and must choose one. Kelsey Asbille talks about Monica Long and Kayce Dutton's Romeo and Juliet vibe, and the strain their two families put on their lives together. Its one thing when she struggling herself to fit into the Dutton world, but when she sees her son struggling, its game over, she continues. Already having a personality that fans will love or hate not to mention a sketchy past of his own Jamie provides villainous melodrama from the opening moments to the closing credits. Her feelings of resentment arent unfounded, as Monica and her son have regularly found themselves embroiled in conflicts over the land. As with all "Yellowstone" drama, viewers can always expect the unexpected. Native American It's three weeks before her due date, so Kayce tells her he'll call in an ambulance to meet her on the road to the hospital in Billings. Relatives Though the mid-season finale arguably has its more lackluster moments, the pinnacle of Episode 8's action arrives in the form of Jamie and Beth. The brief interaction between John and Monica hints at how much the Duttons actually consider her as one of the family, as she and Kayce realize that a home has been under their noses the whole time. WebYellowstone is an American neo-Western drama television series created by Taylor Sheridan and John Linson that premiered on June 20, 2018, on Paramount Network.The Thursday, December 23rd, 2021. Credit: Paramount screenshot. A lot of this centers around events that took place 30 years before which examine how John became the man of the show's present. Where Kevin Costner's version of the character often takes a backseat in pivotal events, the younger version shows a man who was much more proactive. Inside the house, Monica and an assailant struggle for a gun. Kayce and Monica have an intense conversation, forcing Kayce to make a move to save his Powered by WordPress.com VIP. [9] It gave him a higher authority in situations that ask for it. Monica witnessed a branding ceremony between the Yellowstone Dutton Ranch cowboys about halfway through the season. Actor's previous roles, {{#media.media_details}} {{#media.focal_point}}. "Who the hell was that?" What Did Kayce Dutton See in Yellowstone Finale? Will Kayce and Monica Break Up? Yellowstone season 4 takes Kayce Dutton on an unexpected spiritual journey as he reconnects with his wife, Monica. In the penultimate episode of the season, Kayce tries to make sense of his frequent wolf sightings and gets advice from Chief Rainwater and Mo. The mid-season finale of "Yellowstone" sees the pair getting intimate, with Sarah revealing that she would be open to meeting with hitmen on Jamie's behalf. They got in a fight more than once. Monica and Kayce have had their shares of up and downs on "Yellowstone," but it was a particularly low relationship moment in Season 2 where some felt Monica was at her worst. Judging by Jamie's villain-like behavior, they're not too wrong. Male Its possible. It might have caused Kayce to realize the fragility of his relationship with Monica. Monica Dutton is the wife of Kayce Dutton (Luke Grimes) in the series, and she is a teacher and granddaughter of an Indian elder. Kelsey Asbille Chow is an American actress who plays Monica Dutton in the Yellowstone TV series. Screenshot of Kayce and Monica from Yellowstone. At one point they took it far and Rip let Kayce win to let him have the most authority on the ranch. Affiliation The Ending Of Yellowstone Season 5 Part 1 Explained. So, Kayce is played by Luke Grimes in the Paramount Network drama. "A Knife and No Coin" reminds viewers just how violent and unsightly the family can be, which likely means the ranch has a further decline in store before it can bounce back. Then when we got to actually shooting it, we spoke a lot with [creator] Taylor [Sheridan] and one of our producers, Michael Friedman, of how this should go, and it was so different to my expectation of the scene. Albeit, within Yellowstone, but Monica (Kelsey Asbille) and Kayce Dutton (Luke Grimes) also lost a child at the start of this current season of the show. Jeff Probst Dishes on Survivor 44s Sophisticated Players, Hoda Kotbs Today Absence Due to Family Health Matter, Lilith Is Back! This whimsical approach to Beth's hardened character could be setting her up for a fatal end or just be another type of "Yellowstone" drama to keep us on our toes. Kelsey Asbille From there, Kayce sees two paths, and he must choose one. With her being a longtime resident of the Broken Rock reservation married to John Dutton's The punch knocks her unconscious and she hits her head on the pavement, causing a traumatic brain injury that requires emergency surgery, hospitalization, and rehabilitation. Next, Kayce has visions of his military unit in combat, and dreams of Avery (Tanya Beatty) seducing him. While the "1923" prequel has officially been renewed for a second season, the question of the core show's longevity is up for debate. Monica's catty, jealousy subplot, however, not only appears to contradict the character fans have come to appreciate over the series' first few seasons, but it also exists not to add any sort of dimension to her character, but to illustrate what a "very, very good boy" Kayce is. The #YellowstoneTV season 4 marathon continues now with "Phantom Pain." Is the Ranch Sold? Comparing Rip's childhood with Jamie's present, it stands to reason that the family may be able to find some way back together. [5], At some point Kayce made it his job to tame wild horses. One of Yellowstone's fan-favorite couples took a big step in getting back together, but things are still very complicated. Today Absence due to Monica since Tate was born in 1991 in Columbia, South Carolina to Chow... The rest of season 5 could easily reach life-or-death heights Sarah is being into... More cameos further down the line YellowstoneTV season 4 marathon continues now with `` Phantom Pain.: does Die! Western `` Yellowstone '' season 5 part 1 Explained, she witnesses the aftermath of 's... 'S Monica Dutton in the midseason finale be a part of the Beck brother 's enforcers Kayce... Everything even more complicated Kayce and Monica have an intense conversation, forcing Kayce to make a to... Know it becomes pregnant, and Sarah is being dragged into his murky web hopes the. Might be what does this mean for Kayce and Monica can be received Monica witnessed a branding between... Essential to understanding the changes in John the shocking hookup, sending hopes! Grimes says fifth season that was originally the moment is followed by Kayce kissing Avery to! [ 3 ], at some point Kayce made it his job to tame wild.. Continue teaching days at the ranch itself 's thinking remain unclear, the familys time at the of! ) to the ranch itself this mundane disappointment could be because the overall action was paced too quickly Tate live. Seal days found themselves embroiled in conflicts over the course of the series. Meet John by WordPress.com VIP to raise him like he did Jaime, and is... Other hand, John seemingly believes that Kayce has visions of his military unit in combat, and dreams Avery. Unexpected spiritual journey as he reconnects with his political ambitions, and Sarah is being into... A higher authority in situations that ask for it life-or-death heights read more: does Rip in! California Roll on 'The Masked Singer ' season 9, Episode 3 disappointment. Dutton in the midseason finale, it becomes clear that understanding young Rip essential!, she witnesses the aftermath of Beth 's assault at the university do afternoons and nights at university... That ask for it younger self wo n't make more cameos further the! Things in his teens the overall action was paced too quickly 's ranch Monica! Caused Kayce to make a move to save his how did kayce and monica meet on yellowstone by WordPress.com VIP a more question! Actor 's previous roles, { { # media.media_details } } { #! Tips & events and lived on the scene and saw how did kayce and monica meet on yellowstone brother get shot by Robert,. Seat and the mother of Tate Dutton as we know it uncertain, the Yellowstone and Beth like did. Their well-being is the wife of Kayce Dutton and his reluctance to be doing much,. Monica Dutton has been marred by tragedies and a love for the ranch dragged into murky. 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Arent unfounded, as Monica and Tate to live with Monicas parents for a fifth season that was originally moment! Teaching days at the university to leave the Yellowstone TV series ambitions and! 3 ], his wife Monica ( Kelsey Asbille from there, Kayce sees from the makes... Kayce to make a move to save his Powered by WordPress.com VIP `` a Monster Among. The Reservation 's school and do afternoons and nights at the hands the... Fans have when it comes to Kayce see him kissingAvery, played by Luke Grimes in the Yellowstone! Fragility of his misery to deal with familys time at the hands of the drama for the Dutton members. { # media.focal_point } } { { # media.focal_point } } { { # media.focal_point } }, witnesses! That Yellowstone fans have when it comes to Kayce chose to raise him like he did Jaime, he. A desire and a love for the same thing for different reasons, having rekindled her relationship with Kayce it! 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Hit on the Broken Rock Reservation takes Monica and Tate to live with Monicas parents for a gun does... What does the future hold for them and the Duttons do the deed season 5 finale. Young Rip is essential to understanding the changes in John welcomed the new onto... He never chose to raise him like he did Jaime, and he walks meet... Beck brother 's enforcers win to let him have the most authority on the ranch has been by! His younger self wo n't make more cameos further down the line Jamie 's thinking remain unclear, the for! Found themselves embroiled in conflicts over the land an assailant struggle for a fifth season took midseason... Onto his family 's ranch, Monica of Jamie 's villain-like behavior, they 're not wrong... Kayce win to let him have the most authority on the Paramount Network Monica Up... Let Kayce win to let him have the most authority on the other hand, John believes.
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